Small Beginnings – Big Impact – Moving Mountains in the Marketplace – with Peter Dobelbower – [Ep. 289]

Linda J. Hansen:  Thank you for tuning in today. My name is Linda J. Hansen, your host of the Prosperity 101® Podcast, where we seek to unleash the power of employers to reclaim and preserve America by Connecting Boardroom to Breakroom® and policy to paycheck. Employers educating employees about public policy issues that affect their jobs can lead to greater employee loyalty, engagement, and retention, and to an increased awareness of the blessings and responsibilities of living in a free society. 

We help people understand the foundations of true prosperity, the policies of prosperity, and how to protect prosperity by Becoming Informed, Involved, and Impactful®. To access our podcast library and resources, or to sign our Employers Unleashed™ Pledge, visit Prosperity101.com.

Thank you so much for joining with us today. As I often say, it is a pleasure to have you in the audience, and it's just an honor to be with you today, and I know and pray that today's episode will be a blessing to you, and you will learn something as well. If you're a long-time listener, or maybe if you're new, it's good to know why I even do Prosperity 101.

My goal is to empower employers to educate employees about the public policy issues that affect their jobs. We know that millions of people go to voting booths every year and actually vote themselves out of their jobs because they don't understand the impact that policy has on their paychecks. They don't understand what the business leaders, the business owners, go through to provide their jobs.

It's simple to help them learn basic economics and basic civics, but it is not something that's often done in the marketplace. My goal is to empower you, as a business leader, to be able to speak about such things with clarity, simplicity, and truth. That's also why I started Employers Unleashed™.

Employers Unleashed™ is a community of employers seeking to reclaim and preserve America by not only sharing these economic and civic truths, but really helping to impact the seven mountains of culture through the ways they run their businesses. This is how we change a culture. This is how we save a country, because policy isn't made in the capitals.

Policy is created in the culture, and the culture is created through the individuals, the hearts and minds of the individuals. So that's where we want to focus now. An example of a company that has done an amazing job of impacting culture is Hobby Lobby.

I titled this episode, Small Beginnings, Big Impact, Moving Mountains in the Marketplace. My guest today is my dear, dear friend, Peter Dobelbower. Peter is the Senior VP of Legal at Hobby Lobby Stores, and it is just such a joy to know him, to watch the trajectory of his career and the impact that he and the Green family, through Hobby Lobby, have had in America and around the world.

I'm excited for this conversation, Peter. Thank you for being with me, and just welcome.

Peter Dobelbower: Thank you, Linda. I'm really glad to be here and visit with you today.

Linda J. Hansen: Well, our friendship spans quite a while. Do you want to tell the listeners when we first met and how long we've known each other?

Peter Dobelbower: Yeah, I think you'll probably have to tell me how long it's been, but I can tell you, when it started, it was during Herman Cain's campaign for president. I was a big fan of Herman. And in fact, I flew down to Corpus Christi, Texas, to meet him at one of the gatherings that he had at that time, because I was just so impressed with him.

And that's how we met, was through Herman Cain's campaign.

Linda J. Hansen: Yes, exactly. I remember talking to you quite a bit and getting to know you during that time, and the friendship has just advanced through that. And I want to thank you too, because I know over the years, you've been such a great advisor to me with what I do with Prosperity 101®, what I've done with Employers Unleashed™.

You actually joined our last webinar, where we talked about the mountain of culture that includes arts and entertainment. And you joined and talked about how your work and the work of Hobby Lobby and the people within Hobby Lobby have really worked to impact culture on all mountains of culture. So it's just a great story.

If you could share a little bit about how you ended up in your position, I know that's a long story as well, but then what's the mission that the Greens have, that you work so hard to complete? And then we'll go into some real action steps you've taken to educate employees within your workplace, to help them understand how to preserve their freedom and their religious freedom, and how to understand the truth of Scripture.

Peter Dobelbower: Yeah, I certainly wasn't aware of it at the time, but it was about 30 years ago I answered. I was in private practice. I'd been practicing law for about 11 or 12 years at the time, and I was really kind of anxious about doing something different. And so I decided that I would like to find a position in-house somewhere.

I was here in Oklahoma City. I grew up here and went away to my undergraduate at Westminster College in Fulton, Missouri, which is where Winston Churchill gave the Iron Curtain speech. And I came home from college and went to law school and worked for a law firm for a short period of time, then opened up my own firm with a couple other lawyers.

And I did that for about 11 or 12 years. And we grew that firm to about 11 or 12 lawyers. And I decided I wanted to get into in-house if I could.

And I saw, and back then, I saw an ad in the newspaper, because that's where they were advertised. If there was a job, you would look in the classified ads. And I saw this ad in the newspaper in the Daily Oklahoman, and it said simply, local retailer looking for first general counsel and had a post office box and had no idea who it was because it was called a blind box ad.

And so you would just send your resume and a cover letter in on a blind box ad. And I'll never forget when I got the call to say, we've got your application resume, we'd like for you to come in. They said that this is Hobby Lobby.

And my first reaction, my first reaction was, oh, gosh, Hobby Lobby. And you've got to understand, 30 years ago, I didn't do much at Hobby Lobby, didn't do much shopping there, but we had a store in really not the best part of town at that time. And that's where I thought I was going to interview.

And I really thought to myself at the time, well, I need the experience. So I decided, I said, yeah, great, I'll go in. And the building I'm in right now, they had just built this building about a year before, and it's a million square feet, warehouse offices. And so I drove out here. I'm pretty impressed. I thought that was great.

And I went in and I was interviewed by the CFO because the CFO had only been with us not a year. And he told David Green that we needed our own general counsel. David said, fine.

So I interviewed, and probably two or three weeks later, I got a call and said, we'd like for you to come back in and meet David Green. And so I came in, met David, and they hired me. And that will be 30 years on September 16th of this year.

Linda J. Hansen: It's just amazing, and what you and Hobby Lobby have done as you've grown has just had an incredible impact around the world. I don't know that everyone even knows the story of Hobby Lobby. There's many of us who do, but maybe you could just share very, very briefly the intro of how David Green started Hobby Lobby and what his conviction was to stay closed on Sunday and how to protect the families that worked for him and prosper them.

But maybe you could just share a little bit about that, because his vision and his tenacity to stay true to his beliefs is really what built this amazing company and ministry around the world.

Peter Dobelbower: Yeah, there's a lot there to that request, Linda, and I'll tell you why. So when I started, we were just about at our 25th year, believe it or not. Hobby Lobby and David had been in business for about 25 years at the time.

And boy, I'll tell you, I take this for granted so much. And what I mean by that is I could really get emotional about this because this job has been life-changing. And I don't mean from a career standpoint, even though that's true, that's not what's important.

What's important is my spiritual growth. And there's just, I believe, so few people that could say that about their job. You know, the thing that probably is most impactful at this job has been my spiritual growth, and it's because of this family.

You know, David started this company out of his garage. He was a manager at a store here in Oklahoma City called TGNY. TGNY was what was known back then as a five and dime.

And it was, I don't know how you explain it other than possibly a miniature Walmart at the time, a very small footprint. And he was a store manager, and he decided to start making picture frames out of his garage. And so he bought a frame cutter, and he and his wife, Barbara, started this business.

And he had his boys, Steven and Mark, putting the frames together. I think he paid him, oh gosh, I want to say almost like a nickel a frame or something like that, and sold these frames and then eventually started Hobby Lobby a few years later. But it's really been an extraordinary business.

It hasn't always been good. They had some really tough times. They had a note that a bank was going to call, and there's so many miracles behind that.

And what happened there, and unless you've never been to a Hobby Lobby, I mean, most people, if you know about Hobby Lobby, you kind of know about this family, and you know about our belief system. And when you talk about, for instance, being closed on Sundays, well, that didn't happen until after I started. So we're talking, it didn't happen in the first 25 years.

And I don't think it was out of anything other than maybe looking at how businesses operated at that time. And it was just kind of natural that you're open on Sundays. And there came a point where David became extremely convicted.

And I think, probably, would tell you today… I mean, we didn't close all the stores at once, so not complete faith. He'd tell you the same thing, but it didn't take long really at all to realize that we lost nothing by closing on Sunday, absolutely nothing. Our sales increased, and it was just, there's so many obvious signs of just the Lord's blessing on this company and this family.

It's very interesting, and we can get into some of the things, or stop me because I could go on. I've got 30 years under my belt, so I could go on for a long time. But this family, people will find this extremely hard to believe, but it's true. They now give 60% of their profits to Christian ministries, 60% of their profits. It's just, it's extraordinary, what they do.

Linda J. Hansen: It is. And they've had such a commitment to not being in debt and to sharing around the world. Many people might not realize that the Museum of the Bible was really founded by them, and we wouldn't even have the absolutely beautiful Museum of the Bible without them.

There are so many other ministries. I'm sure that you could share some. I know that they have helped fund films.

There's so many things, and through my Employers Unleashed™ community and the webinars I do, we talk about taking back these seven mountains of culture, the business, family, education, media, arts & entertainment, government & military, and religion. And I always say business touches every single mountain of culture. Through the work that we do, through the relationships that we have, we touch every single mountain of culture.

And when I think of a business that has touched mountains of culture, not only here in the U.S., but around the world, even by the way they do business with overseas partners, it's really incredible. So when we talk about reclaiming our nation, preserving the freedoms that we have, and elevating our nation back to this Judeo-Christian base that started this beautiful, beautiful nation that we have, they're doing so by example, and it's really exciting.

Peter Dobelbower: Yeah, it really is. And you talk about the Museum of the Bible, which is an extraordinary thing. And it was a lot of work.

I don't think Steve Green, who really is the founding force behind the museum, I don't think he necessarily intended this at all. As a matter of fact, I think there were a few guys that came in and talked to him about preserving some old manuscripts. They wanted to start their own museum, and it just kind of went off from there.

And it's been an extraordinary ministry for this company. It really has.

Linda J. Hansen: Well, and I can highly recommend a visit there. Even if you might be listening, and you might not be a believer in Jesus, you might wonder what the Bible is all about, and you might just think, what does it even mean? The Bible in history is enough to just overwhelm you with amazement.

But spiritually, it's hard not to be touched when you go to the Museum of the Bible and you see the reality of truth in Scripture. And so I'm so grateful that they have followed through on that vision. And I mean, it's such an impact right there in Washington, D.C. 

Big sign at the top of the building, Museum of the Bible, and bringing light into a sometimes dark place. So thank you to the Green family and to all who are a part of that. But they've also been involved in helping to fund great films, books, things that really impact culture. We might not have time to go into all of that, but there is something.

I mean, maybe we can go back to it, but there is something else. I definitely want to cover before we run out of time. And that is something you recently did with your employees in your department to help them understand the beautiful history of America, the importance of protecting their freedom, and just the blessings and responsibilities of living in this free society.

So as I talk about employers impacting employees, this was a perfect example. And so can you share and give these ideas to those who may be listening?

Peter Dobelbower: Yeah, absolutely. I want to take one step back for just a moment regarding the museum, because you said something that I think is very important, especially for those people that are listening today that might not be a believer. The Museum of the Bible is there for you to make your decision.

They don't walk around proselytized at all. This is such an extraordinary history book of our history, of world history. And especially at this time of our 250th, when you realize that the book that was in almost every home at our founding was the Bible.

People learned how to read as a result of the Bible. They may not have any other book but the Bible. And so going to the Museum of the Bible, you're going to learn these things.

You're also going to be able to make your own decisions about how these things progressed and how it was used in our founding.

Linda J. Hansen: I'm actually so glad you brought that up, because I think sometimes people might be afraid to go. They think they're going to be pushed into a certain religious view or pushed to become a Christian. It is just an amazing place to go and learn and see not only the history and how it has impacted our nation, but worldwide.

I mean, you can see Bibles in every language. We don't have quite all the languages translated yet, but we're getting there. But the amazing history of the importance of Scripture throughout the world.

And it's incredible. So, we really recommend anybody to go. And don't worry, people aren't going to hit you over the head and make you not at all like them.

The wonderful thing about Christianity is that no one makes you do it. It is a personal choice. It is just definitely between you and God.

So before we move further, I do just want to take a pause and say, if anybody's listening right now, and there's something that we have said that touches your heart and tells you, wait, maybe I don't know about Jesus. Maybe I don't know. Maybe I need to learn.

We just encourage you. It's just a beautiful time to just bow your head and say, Lord Jesus, I want you to be my Lord and Savior. Show me, show me the way for my life.

It's a simple thing, but it absolutely changes your life. And, we want every listener out there to become all that God created you to be and for you to fill your fullest potential in Jesus and to have that peace and joy in Jesus. And if you don't, please reach out to Peter, reach out to me, go to the Museum of the Bible and just learn, study.

And if you can't get there because it's too far away, you can go online and see many things that will help you. But, don't let it scare you. And just remember, Christianity is really the only religion where you get to choose to have that relationship with God.

It is really something where Jesus offers it to you and it's up to you. It's a gift, but it's up to you to receive it. So thank you for bringing that up, Peter.

But now let's transition back into what you do with your employees. And it's just an exciting thing that you did to celebrate America's 250th birthday.

Peter Dobelbower: Yeah, it was last November. And, with everything that's going on in our nation right now, I looked at this and I thought to myself how much our founding has been lost on younger generations, not really understanding it. And, in fact, oftentimes we even take things for granted. And so I wanted to figure out a way to do this. 

I introduced this idea to them last November. I wrote a letter to them and just said that we're going to learn about how to be civil. We're going to learn how our country was founded and why it was founded. I knew I had to be sensitive to people who would be afraid. Because I mean, if you work at Hobby Lobby, you know where the Green family stands. I tell people that unless you've been living under a rock, you're going to know who we are, our founders, what they stand for.

And so I wanted to be careful that I wouldn't make anybody uncomfortable. And so I put together a curriculum and I said, we're going to learn about our founding and how blessed we are. And so for six months, we finished on July 1st, but every month I would take them through a series of videos. 

I started off with Jamestown and the Great Awakening because I needed them to understand why the people from Europe and other countries came here. What it was about this country that they came to.

And so I took them through that. And then I took them through the acts, all the different acts that Great Britain was putting on us in order to pay for the French and Indian War and other things and why people got upset about that. No taxation without representation, understanding what that actually meant.

Again, some of us can take this stuff for granted, but a lot of people… I wasn't interested in history as a kid. None of this really mattered to me when I was a kid. And I think a lot of people felt that way, too.

And then after that, I took them through Lexington and Concord videos on all that. And then after that, I took them through the Declaration of Independence. I went ahead and jumped into the Constitution because I only had six months to do this and to be able to explain it to them.

But through this whole process, we had different contests. So I've got about 70 cubicles here that my employees are in. So we did a cubicle decorating contest and we did it every month.

So some people would decorate their cubicle, take it apart and do something different. And it was just extraordinary. They had so much fun.

I bought about six cookbooks from the 1700s and I put them in our mail room. And once a month, we have a food day and I gave points for anybody who made something from one of those cookbooks. And they'd have to put out the recipe. They have to copy the recipe off. 

They get points for doing that. And then the one thing that I thought, I'll probably break my arm patting myself on the back here, but I created a bingo game. And the cool thing about the bingo game is all the answers, the questions would have to be researched to be able to find the answer. And I thought, what a great way for them to learn. But the first bingo game, the person said bingo pretty quickly.

I mean, I had 76 questions on the bingo game. And I think there was bingo after 23 and I think, what am I going to do? And so I decided, you know what, I'm going to have biggest loser bingo.

So the last person that gets a blackout will win. And so they went through all 76 questions they had to learn. Then after that one, I did another bingo. And actually that bingo is still going on. It will end this Friday. And then the other thing I did, I gave a test every month based on the videos that I showed and I would give about 20 multiple choice questions.

And so they went through, they did five tests and there was a point where, I think it was the second test, they didn't like one of the answers that I thought was correct. And I think they were probably right. It was not a good answer.

But anyway, they decided they were going to have a revolution. So they had their own no kings day because I was kind of the king, they said. And they ended up doing a big poster, no kings, and they were going to have a revolution.

And I went and put a big circle and a line through it. And I wrote at the top, it's still a monarchy until July 4th. But, everybody's had a lot of fun.

We ended on July 1st and everybody got dressed up in colonial attire, not everybody, but a lot of people got dressed up in colonial attire. And we just had a wonderful celebration, a very patriotic celebration. It lasted about an hour and a half.

I had the sons of the American revolution come in their color guard to open us. We sang, we said the Pledge of Allegiance and we sang the National Anthem. And then we sang patriotic songs.

We had some, some of our people are very talented. And they played the guitar and the piano. And then I had a young lady who's 19 years old that my wife and I met, who plays the violin and she played old violin music throughout our whole lunch.

And it was just beautiful. Yeah. And so it was great.

And I think, I know so many people came up to me and the department and said, either, they never knew these things or they're just so glad. And it's just renewed in them a spirit of patriotism. And I'm not done.

We're still going to do more, but our big things are over and the contests are over. And it was a lot of work and I have a new found appreciation for teachers. Believe me.

Linda J. Hansen: Well, this is just such a great example where this is probably a little more intense than many employers would like to do, or maybe can do based on their budget or their timeframe or what their workforce is. But there's always something. And I always tell people that when you take time to educate your workforce about the things that will help them protect their freedom, their flourishing, their families, they're grateful.

They become very grateful. And then they realize that this is a place that they can be loyal to. This is someone that deserves their respect. So it really does increase, I believe, loyalty, engagement, retention, and I'd say to employers or business leaders out there who might not have the resources or time that Peter did. There's so many things you can do. And that's why I have the Breakroom Economics® online course.

It's designed to be just 12 short lessons. It's short little videos, three to five minutes each with a very short lesson and a transcript that goes with it. And then after each section, we have a short quiz. That's a self quiz. They're not getting graded like you did. But if an employer wanted to do that, they could.

So my Breakroom Economics® course can be used as a lunch and learn series, workshop, it could be used as independent study, just something that an employer offers to their employees as a perk. And if they ever want to talk about it, they can. 

Some employers don't know what to say and they're afraid to talk, or maybe their workforce is so small, something this organized might feel unnatural. And so they just use something like this. I have one employer who has the course and he just talks through things with his employees and it's not so formal. 

So however you choose to do it, please do educate your employees, your workforce, those who work under you or with you regarding the basic freedoms of our nation, how to protect them, how to be an active citizen.

And then also as believers serving in the marketplace, we have open conversations with why it matters. You know, we want to protect that freedom for all people to make the choice if they choose Jesus or whatever they choose. We want religious freedom. We want economic freedom. We want families to be able to raise their families in the way they desire. And we want to make sure that human flourishing and freedom is what is promoted.

And that's what our nation offers. And it's important for us to educate our workforce about that.And when we do that, we can move those cultural mountains, those seven mountains of culture. We can really move those mountains of culture so that we can positively impact our nation and the world.

Peter Dobelbower: What I was going to say is, because I'm thinking about how you are expressing or educating our workforce. And I've found that, typically when you have a room full of people, especially when you have a room full of just about 80 people, they typically are quiet as you're talking to them or engaging.

And it's hard sometimes to engage people. And it makes the person who is trying to teach, it can make that person uncomfortable. And I think probably one of the ways you have to, at least for me, and the reason I think it was successful is that I make sure, first of all, that I know everybody in my department.

And I know a little bit about their life. I know a little bit about what's going on with them. But, really, they spend so much of their time at work. And I always make them feel like we're family. I tell them we're family. I want to take care of you.

I want to make sure that you're content, you're happy, because when you have a happy workforce, they want to do things for you. They want to help you succeed. They want to help the company succeed.

So with respect to engaging people to educate them, I would suggest finding some of those people in those departments that you can go with one-on-one to help engage others. And it becomes, I think it becomes very successful. They know you care.

It's not just a process you're going through. You actually want to engage them to make their life better. And I have found that there have been people who get engaged that I would have never thought got engaged, because they know that I care about them.

Linda J. Hansen: And that's the base for what we do. We care about these people. We care about the future of our nation.

We care about not only people we work with now, but their children, their grandchildren. We want freedom and flourishing to be for them and the opportunity to become all that God created them to be. So just thank you.

And I know our time is up. Do you have any other things to say, especially to those who might be afraid to do something to educate employees in the workplace? I mean, we need to help employees understand the basis of our government and our society so that they don't keep choosing the path that history has already told us will bring destruction.

I mean, they're looking at socialism and communism and all these different government systems, and they just don't understand. So what would you say to listeners about the importance of this?

Peter Dobelbower: Yeah, I think you have to start feeding them in some way. Linda, what you're doing with Prosperity 101® is just such a great tool for people to use. I think in order to be able to engage folks, you just need to start talking about it.

You have to talk about it because it's out there. We see all this stuff. We're constantly bombarded in social media and press with just all the stuff that's going on today.

It's just almost hard to believe that we're hearing so much about this socialism and that people are voting these people in. For people like us, Linda, it makes no sense. It really doesn't.

But I know, I've got a bunch of young people out here that probably look at that as being somewhat attractive, and it's only because they don't know. They don't really understand. I loved it.

Sorry I'm taking up time, but I loved watching these videos from all these people that came over for the World Cup. Oh my goodness, it was beautiful.

Linda J. Hansen: It was extraordinary.

Peter Dobelbower: What better way to introduce social media to some of these people than to look at some of those videos. I've thought about doing that, just having a clip of these videos. I'm sure they've all seen them because they're all on social media all the time.

Linda J. Hansen: But actually, a lot of them haven't. I've actually talked to people who haven't seen any of it. They're on social media all the time, and it all depends on the algorithm. It all depends on the algorithm. 

There are people who have never seen these amazing testimonies of people who've come and said, I never want to leave this country. I don't want to go back to my home country. They have said, our country needs to apologize to America for portraying America as so divided and awful and mean-spirited. The people here are amazing. The country is amazing. The freedoms here are incredible. 

We kept hearing that over and over and over again. But I will say that there's a strong portion of society that is never going to get fed that in their social media. We really need to pray. But also, like you said, do what we can do to get that truth out and let people make their decision. You know, Herman Cain always used to say, if people have the right information, they will make the right decision.

And we just need to get that out there to them and let them make the decision. Just like their spiritual decision is between them and God, their decision and how they go into a voting booth is totally up to them. We're not telling anyone what to think or what to do.

But I do feel it is our responsibility to share truth and help them understand because they have not been taught. And what I say is, if employers do not teach these people that are in the workforce now, who will? Because they've already come up through school.

So employers out there, business leaders, managers, please work with us, help us educate those in your workplace who may not understand these principles and how much it affects their freedom and their daily life.

Peter Dobelbower: Absolutely.

Linda J. Hansen: So if people would like to learn about you or maybe even contact you, how would they do so?

Peter Dobelbower: Yeah. Well, I have a shortened email address. I mean, you could do peter.dobelbower at HobbyLobby.com.

But it's so much easier to do P-M-Dobie. And it's P like in Peter, M like in Michael Dobie, D-O-B-I-E, pmdobie@HobbyLobby.com. And I'm happy to respond to anybody that reaches out.

Linda J. Hansen: Well, that would be wonderful. I'm sure you've been an encouragement to everyone and a great example. And you're a wonderful friend to me and I appreciate that so much.

Peter Dobelbower: So thank you, Linda.

Linda J. Hansen: Hope to have you back on again soon.

Peter Dobelbower: Absolutely. God bless you.

Linda J. Hansen: Thank you. You too. Thank you again for tuning in to this episode of the Prosperity 101® podcast.

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